The Bangkok Post's Veera Prateepchaikul in an op-ed yesterday:
The most controversial and disturbing of all the controversies started by firebrand PM's Office Minister Jakrapob Penkair seems to be the long speech he delivered to the Foreign Correspondents Club in Bangkok last August shortly after he was released from jail for his role in the violent anti-Prem demonstration.
Of all the so-called "lightning rod" ministers in the cabinet of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej, Prime Minister's Office Minister Jakrapob Penkair appears to stand out. In just three months, this former leader of the anti-Prem United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UFDD) has firmly established himself as a controversial figure in government.
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But the most controversial and disturbing of all the controversies started by the firebrand minister seems to be the long speech he delivered to the Foreign Correspondents Club in Bangkok last August shortly after he was released from jail for his role in the violent anti-Prem demonstration.
We would have been totally in the dark about Jakrapob's talk to foreign correspondents had it not been for the Democrats who took pains to get the controversial speech transcribed and translated into Thai.
There is no doubt that the translation was politically motivated. But that is a different issue from the lecture itself by a man who now fills an important post in the government.
As members of the public, I believe we are entitled to know what a minister thinks about our highest institution, the monarchy, and what he has to say on the subject in public.
The title of the long lecture is "Democracy and the Patronage System of Thailand".
I will not elaborate on the content of Jakrapob's speech, since it has already been widely distributed. Whether several remarks in the lecture are deemed lese majeste or not I have no idea, but after having read the full text I feel some of the remarks are disturbing and unpleasant.
For example, the opening statement reads: "I just got out of Prem's prison. It is not a general jail. It's Khun Prem's jail... Who is Khun Prem, who he represents, represents him, will be a part of what we can discuss tonight..."
It clearly reflects his negative attitude toward the Privy Council president.
What Jakrapob discussed at length about the patronage system is totally different from the controversial remarks regarding the monarch made by former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra before the coup in 2006 as the latter's remarks appeared to be a slip of the tongue, not a long lecture prepared in advance.
BP: If I said that Veera's op-ed was disturbing and unpleasant, but I will not elaborate on what he said, am I really helping my readers? Also, Prem does not equal the royal institution and patronage system does not equal the monarchy - Jakrapob represents how he himself was a beneficiary of the patronage system as a result of his father, but his father has no relation to the royal family. It was not a lecture. Jakrapob was not reading from a teleprompter or reading out a speech. It was a presentation. Although, it is interesting that Veera is somehow defending Thaksin now. I don't remember any such leeway given to Thaksin by the Post back then.
I personally didn't think it was a great presentation, but the threat which The Manager, Veers and others are making it out to be is ridiculous.
btw, perhaps given Jakrapob's talk was announced in advance and newspapers sent journalists there, how in the dark have we all been? Does he even realise his own newspaper carried a report (unfortunately, the link doesn't work anymore) off the talk? I realise Veera is like a frog who lives in a coconut shell* and doesn't seem to expand on his narrow thinking, but it was not unknown what Jakrapob was talking about.
*see an explanation of the Thai idiom here.
Pundit on 20/5/08: If I said that Veera's op-ed was disturbing and unpleasant, but I will not elaborate on what he said, am I really helping my readers? Also, Prem does not equal the royal institution and patronage system does not equal the monarchy
Pundit on 30/8/07: Jakrapob gave an interesting presentation looking at the relationship between the patronage system (principally the monarchy) and democracy in Thailand.
Unless Prem is kicked off the Privy Council, I choose to believe he represents the royal institution, and therefore IMO, criticizing Prem is criticizing the monarchy.
I might add, that in relation to his dealings with the south, I thing Prem should definitely be criticized.
(lucky, I suppose that I'm not in Thailand)
As for all the alleged political interference, well personally I don't blame him if he has tried to pull them into line- I still believe if the quality of politicians was better, then such influence would not be warranted, or tolerated.
I should clarify that when I say criticizing Prem is criticizing the monarchy, I do not mean in a legal/lese majeste type sense, but rather in a practical common sense 'calling a spade a spade' way.
Hobby: That part was the historical background which he spent a good period of time talking about. This is where he principally talked about the monarchy. The monarchy is part of the patronage system just like it is part of Thai society. Or is critiquing Thai society critiquing the monarchy?
I thought you also said you could not see anything lese majeste.
When Prem has directorships at certain companies, can we then criticise those companies or decisions the directors make? Or are they part of the institution?
btw, I am surprised you didn't make the connection with Chavalit. Jakrapob is seeking a patron. Chavalit isn't part of the monarchy obviously.
Pundit: I have stated my view on lese majeste many times - IMO the charge should only be able to be made by the monarchy itself.
I also have said that I could not see anything lese majeste in Jakrapobs speech (unless reading between the lines counts, which obviously it should not).
I also posted a clarification (before your response) that although I do see criticizing Prem as criticizing the monarchy, in a down to earth, calling a 'spade a spade' type of way, I did not think it was, or should be seen as such, in a legalistic/lese majeste kind of way.
As for the Chavalit connection, I had already made it in the Democrats not happy about Jakrapob thread (also before your response).
Frankly, this whole lese majeste thing gives me the shits, not only because it is used unfairly, but also because it makes everyone play games - It's clear that many people, including the likes of Chotisak & Jakrapob clearly have issues with the monarchy, but due to lese majeste they can only go so far before self preservation kicks in.
The Democrat's role (and old ginger figures like Surayud, military figures like Sathirapan & Chalit) is despicable as they know there can never be a proper discussion of the issues.
IMO they would be better off calling for books like Handley's to be allowed to be read openly, it would kill off the oxygen to the rabid types on the boards they keep trying to ban, and some sensible discussion might finally take place.
Hobby: I actually didn't see your clarification or your other comment until after I posted my comment (yes, yes, it was my fault for approving this comment first and not approving all your other comments before posting) the time datestamp is the time you make the comment, but I didn't approve them until later.
Dare I say we are in agreement in the rest of what you say.
I attended the Jakrapop presentation and at the time did think it was "great". Jakrapop does get a bit full of himself and has a weakness for the overdramatic, but the core message was simple and extremely powerful.
As I said at the time, he provided and epic narrative for the current struggle in Thailand that links it with similar developments in other countries around the world.
When analysed outside of the sheltered perspective of the traditional Thai coconut, it is clear that we have witnessed the same actors and the same scenes around the world. Inward looking feudal aristocracies built on rent seeking, self perpetuating myths and delibrate ignorance of the world, haven't fared well.
When you look at Thailand with the myopic lense of Veera, Sopon, etc, things seem very complicated and any change looks horrible. But when you move back to the level of the universal, it becomes clear that the Thai elite are terrified of progress because it will slash their benefits, and because they can't hold it off much longer.
Jakrapop is on the right side of history, and he knows it.
In addition to the hypocrisy which has already been discussed, I find it sad that incidents like this are clearly designed to intimidate anyone from discussing sensitive yet crucial issues at the FCCT. Still, I'm sure that's what certain people intended all along.
Observer. I think parts of the presentation were good, but overall and upon reflection I though parts of his presentation lacked structure and also some of the comments he made about Prem's jail and that other comment about Prem seemed rather silly and I think detracted from his overall argument.
Jakrapop is on the right side of history, and he knows it
More likely that he is writing his version of history.
Jakrapop does get a bit full of himself and has a weakness for the overdramatic...
Speaking of being overdramatic, was Jakrapob the producer and narrator of this video ?
The other one is here
Thanks to Prachatai.com
BP,
I do agree with your take, but even now, reading the transcript, I do feel that he touched on some very deep and powerful issues in a way that no one else has ever dared to.
I do think Jakrapop is as much clown as prophet, but the standards are low and he is one of the few saying what needs to be said.
If it was all silly, I don't think the Democrats and media would have worked themselves into such a fervor.
Separarely, I have two related questions / requests:
1) Does anyone know of a source for the tape of judges fixing the decision that Jakrapop refers to. One thing I have learned is that primary sources are often very different from how the secondary sources describe them. The tape was played publicly, it must be available.
2) Does anyone have a link to the photo of Suriyasai Katasila clinking glasses with General Saprang? No particular reason for this, but have heard about it and would like to see it. Pictures can be worth more than 1o00 words. Might make T shirts.
When analysed outside of the sheltered perspective of the traditional Thai coconut, it is clear that we have witnessed the same actors and the same scenes around the world. Inward looking feudal aristocracies built on rent seeking, self perpetuating myths and delibrate ignorance of the world, haven't fared well.
Bravo Observer ! I think you've described things in a very clear manner.
I fully share your views.
By the way, Nation put online the video of Jakrapob's speech.
That’s his voice. As I said, he is a bit excitable.
However, the video does paint a much clearer picture of what happened at the event than Veera’s claim that it "lead to violence", implying the protestors were to blame.
Again, Jakrapop is annoying, but right. It does appear that a peaceful protest was forcibly broken up, probably without legal grounds.
This is a big part of why PPP supporters will never listen to the wisdom of their betters at The Nation. Bangkok media depicts rural protestors are rude, violent and destructive. But you can see the truth on video.
It seems very obvious to me that this was a legal demonstration that was broken up with the tools of an authoritarian state. This never happened to the PAD, and Bangkok would have been in hysterics with 1/10th of it.
They should fire Veera and give you the column space.... Then again, this is Thailand, a country where sub-standard bogshite is tolerated, if not loved.
hobby: although I do see criticizing Prem as criticizing the monarchy, in a down to earth, calling a 'spade a spade' type of way, I did not think it was, or should be seen as such, in a legalistic/lese majeste kind of way.
hobby: It's clear that many people, including the likes of Chotisak & Jakrapob clearly have issues with the monarchy, but due to lese majeste they can only go so far before self preservation kicks in.
"Here you're obliged to falsify yourself"
This is my all-time favorite quotation from Marx's 1843 letter to his friend, explaing why he had to leave Germany.
Jakrapob made several statements that are most definately Lese Majeste, he is a danger to himself and his country
I am glad that the Thais are not stupid enough to fall for this pathetic puppet
Jakrapob made several statements that are most definately Lese Majeste, he is a danger to himself and his country
I could not see any lese majeste in the FCCT speech, but it would not surprise me if he has committed lese majeste elsewhere (particularly if he is a person concerned with speaking about the truth).
I agree he is a danger to himself, but not the to the country - IMO he is a drama queen, but also a hero for trying to speak the truth on the patronage issue.
Judging by the latest newspapers, it looks like the writing is already on the wall for Jakrapob, and he will be left to take the fall on his own.
I know it's easy for me to say whilst hiding behind an alias, and not even being in Thailand, but Jakrapob has a chance to be a real hero/martyr if he sticks to his guns and explains what he was on about - wouldn't it be great if a prominent identity could bring it all out into the open instead of being 'obliged to falsify yourself' as per Somsaks's Marx.
IMO in looking for people like Chavalit & Thaksin to help him, Jakrapob is turning to the wrong people if he wants to get the message out - I think he should be looking to human rights groups, academics, legal experts and even activists for moral support.
I'm really starting to despise Abbhisit, and about the only way he could restore any faith would be to table Handley's TKNS into parliament and say 'lets discuss the issues'.
How about a debate on ' the patronage system in Thailand' or even 'network monarchy' - not behind closed doors in a university, but in parliament or on tv, or even via newspaper columns.
Observer: Regarding those video's, I see them more as slick propaganda because at the time there were other videos which showed a different version of proceedings - the truth was probably somewhere in the middle, in that both the authorities and the protesters had people in their ranks that behaved poorly, leading to the violence.
Hobby,
Drama queen hero. Agree that sums it up about right.
I also agree regarding the video. I don't doubt that there is propaganda and spinning on all sides. And a manufactured video like that is not exactly a primary source. But my broader point stands, we need to look past the message sent out by the media, etc. Actual video of events is a better guide to interpretting them than Veera and co.
Jakrapop can not really turn to the NGGo sector, because there is not really a legitimate NGO sector.
This Wiki page lists NGO stars like Rewadee Prasertcharoensuuk and Rosana Tositrakul amomg others as core PAD supporters.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Alliance_for_Democracy